“Unto the woman (Eve) he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and they conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children, and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.”
That is the order of the sexes as God laid it down from the start. The man was to be the head of the woman. Not that she was his slave or somebody to be walked on, as most cultures have made it.
“Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, (not as some slave master, but like a husband) as unto the Lord.”
What in the world could possibly be wrong with being submissive to that kind of husband? Ninety-nine point nine percent of women would just revel in that kind of a relationship, to be married to a man who treats her, even as the Lord treats him, and that is the example throughout Paul’s letters regarding men, women and the order set by God.
Now verse 23. Why should the wife submit to the husband? Because of God’s decree.
“For the husband is the head of the wife, (and again look at the analogy) even as Christ is the head of the church: (the Body of Christ) and he is the savior of the body.”
Read full commentary below the post.
Southern Baptists are arguing again over the role women should play in the church
Following a tweet from popular Southern Baptist speaker, teacher, and writer Beth Moore that suggested she was preaching at a Southern Baptist church, many Baptist leaders accused her of defying God’s word. These Baptist leaders believe women cannot hold positions of authority over men and that means they shouldn’t preach, teach men, or serve as pastor.
The president of the Southern Baptist Theological Seminary went so far as to say, “I think there’s just something about the order of creation that means that God intends for the preaching voice to be a male voice.”
Beth Moore is theologically conservative and doesn’t believe women should be pastors. But her recent tweet renewed a debate that’s been an issue for more than 300 years.
The issue of women’s leadership has raged among Baptists since the beginning of the denomination in 17th century England.
Women preachers among early Baptists
As a researcher who studies Baptist women and was also ordained by Shalom Baptist Church in Louisville in 1993, I’m deeply familiar with this history.
Only a few years after Baptists arose in England, women began teaching and preaching, particularly in London.
- Baptists believe God speaks directly to each individual, and, each person’s conscience, under God’s guidance, directs their belief and behavior.
- Baptists also believe that each individual church is autonomous and should make its own decisions rather than relying on the authority of a bishop or pope. These core Baptist convictions led to great disagreements.
- Early Baptists disagreed over, for example, whether salvation was available to everyone or only to those whom God had predestined. They even disagreed over whether or not hymn-singing was appropriate.
- And, from the beginning, Baptists also disagreed on women preaching. Some congregations allowed it while others did not.
Even women who preached were not ordained. As Baptists set up processes for how churches would administer themselves, they limited ordination to men.
But some of the women justified their preaching by hearkening back to biblical times. They gave examples of the leadership of women such as Miriam, sister of Moses, who was a prophetess. They quoted an 11-century B.C. prophetess Deborah, who was a judge of the Israelites. Based on Baptist beliefs, they claimed a calling from a higher authority than church or government.
No Women Should Never Take a Position of Authority over Men
The apostle Paul was never against women. I’ve been teaching Bible classes 3 times a week of years for 2 1/2 years and have come across many women and men who are under the impression that Paul had something against women.
My first response is always don’t realize that Paul is writing under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit is God? The reality of this issue comes down to faith. Those in opposition to God’s clear commands are always destitute of faith or low-faith.
There is no Scripture support for women to have authority over men or Pastor a Church. God laid the order of things in the very beginning in Genesis 3:16, and it’s just the opposite.
‘To the woman He said: “I will greatly multiply your sorrow and your conception; In pain you shall bring forth children; Your desire shall be for your husband, And he shall rule over you.”’
This is really simple, anytime mankind starts to turn from what is so clearly delineated in Scripture the issue ALWAYS COMES DOWN TO FAITH. The moment mankind starts to think for himself he’s is no longer being obedient to Christ.
‘But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.’
Back to the apostle Paul for just a minute, whenever people say Paul had something against women I take them back to Romans 16, where the apostle commends more women than men who had helped him in the ministry.
There is a place for women in the Body of Christ but there are also clear commands given by God not only for order in the Church and how Pastors and Deacons are to be chosen (qualifications).
Let’s take a look at what the Word of God says about order in the Church and what the qualifications are for Pastor and Deacons.
The first thing that you should recognize is the Holy Spirit’s use of pronouns! Remember, this isn’t Paul waking up one morning and saying to himself “I feel like making some rules about how to set up the Church”. No way! This is God the Holy Spirit inspiring the apostle Paul to write. So any issue that some men and women have with what Paul wrote isn’t an issue with Paul at all, their controversy is with the Holy Spirit.
I Timothy 2:11
“Let the women learn in silence with all subjection.” Now don’t take that to the extreme. That doesn’t mean that women are to be walked on and are to be treated as second class citizens, but it all goes back to Eve.
In fact, let’s chase it back right now before we go any further. Let’s go to Genesis chapter 3. God in His mercy did not lay the blame of the curse upon Eve. You all know that. That was placed on Adam, but you also know who ate first! Eve did. She didn’t come through that Scott-free just because Adam was given the fault for the fall of man.
Eve also came under one of the judgments of God because of what she had done. Never forget, even though women are on the same level ground with men in the Body of Christ, yet in the overall umbrella of God’s Sovereignty we have to always remember what took place in the beginning. Verse 16 of chapter 3 of Genesis.
“Unto the woman (Eve) he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and they conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.”
That is the order of the sexes as God laid it down at the very beginning. The Man was to be the head of the woman. Not that she was his slave or somebody to be walked on, as most cultures have made it.
This is the Sovereign working of God. So now, He causes Paul to write:
I Timothy 2:12
“But I suffer (permit) not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man but to be in silence.” God’s Sovereign design is clearly expressed in this verse. That women were not to be in a position of placing men under their authority.
The man was to maintain the place of authority but that didn’t mean that women could not function in other roles in the Body of Christ.
Now in verse 13 Paul, directed by the Holy Spirit writes the reason, which I have just shown you in Genesis, why it is this way.
I Timothy 2:13
“For Adam was first formed, then Eve.”
Adam was created first and on the scene for long time before God took Eve out of Adam. Adam named all the creatures of creation before Eve appeared. Paul is using this as one of the Sovereign reasons for men to be in the place of authority. Because man was made first and then Eve and then the next one is in verse 14. Adam was not deceived! Eve was. This fact is made for a reason!
I Timothy 2:14
“And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.” In other words, she ate without realizing what she was doing.
Then verse 15…
I Timothy 2:15a
“Notwithstanding…” Just because Eve was in the transgression, she certainly didn’t lose the opportunity for salvation and as we well know, women are saved just as well as men. I think I can clarify verse 15 just a little bit.
I Timothy 2:15b
“…she shall be saved in childbearing,…”
Not by giving birth to children that was never the meaning. What it means is that it would be through a woman giving birth to Savior of the world would not only women be saved but man.
I Timothy 2:15c
“…if they continue in faith and charity (love) and holiness with sobriety.” Sobriety, which is not as good a word as I think self restraint. A shyness of sorts, that they are not abrasive.
Please, you have to understand the historical setting of these letters 1 & 2 Timothy that Paul wrote way back in probably 63-64 AD. All of these believers, with the exception of the Jewish contingent, had come from a pagan and dark background.
Now in that pagan culture, never forget that gross immorality was the norm. So keep all of these things in mind when you look at some of the things that Paul wrote.
The scene in-time when Paul is writing hasn’t changed in 1 Timothy chapter 3 Verse 1:
I Timothy 3:1a
“This is a true saying”,… Remember, Paul is writing this letter with the instructions on how to have that local Church function in the midst of all this pagan idolatry, on the one hand and Judaism on the other. We’ve come almost full circle with the gross immorality in the world today (2019) and falling away from the Truth of God’s Word in the Church.
I Timothy 3:1b
“… If a man desires the office of a bishop, (Pastor) he desireth a good work.”
One thing that I would like to clarify is the three words that Paul uses in Ephesians and here in Timothy and again in Titus, and that is the word “bishop” and “elder” and “deacon.”
Now, an elder and a bishop were basically the same things, but the bishop was the “office” – the position. The “elder” or Pastor was the “man.” Then the deacon was the other segment of church officers who were to be just like they were back in Act chapter 6. The deacons in the early church were servants. They were more or less the men in the church who would take care of the needs of the people.
So you have two offices, even though we are using three terms. Don’t confuse that. A bishop and an elder were basically the same thing and then you have the deacon. Now, let’s move on. We are going to deal first with the office of the bishop or the elders.
‘This is a faithful saying: If a man desires the position of a bishop (Pastor), he desires a good work. ‘
‘A bishop then must be blameless (Common sense right? What good would it do to have a pastor who had a shady reputation? The world would scoff at Pastor that was anything less, which they already do!), the husband of one wife, temperate, sober-minded, of good behavior, hospitable, able to teach;’
‘not given to wine (not to drink regularly), not violent (not to be a man that would get into a physical brawl), not greedy for money (he was not to desire money to buy material things), but gentle, not quarrelsome, not covetous;’
He was not to be caught up in the things of this world desiring material things. Quite a condemnation based on what see of many Pastors on TV, in the news, and on social media? They are anything but separated from the world!
Now verse 4:
I Timothy 3:4
“One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection (obedient children. Getting along well with his wife.) with all gravity;” Then the reason is in verse 5.
I Timothy 3:5
“(For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)”
Which is the same kind of thing? You have families. You have children. You have teenagers. You have young married couples. How can you deal with all those problems if you have never been there yourself? So it is logical. It is just plain common sense.
Alright, verse 6, another good one!
I Timothy 3:6a
“Not a novice,…”
You have to have the experience. He must have the knowledge before God will use someone like that. So here it is again in verse 6 that even the bishop or pastor was not to be a novice. Not a beginner and the reason why…
I Timothy 3:6b
“…lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.” In other words, to be a Pastor took a man with Spiritual maturity.
Then verse 7.
I Timothy 3:7
“Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without;…”
That’s common sense, right? How far can a Pastor get in his community if he doesn’t have character. How much good can he do in a community if no one speaks well of him.
Now verse 8,
I Timothy 3:8
Even though they are in a little different role than the pastor, the deacons are in that same place of responsibility and they are to be that same kind of testimony as the bishops were. Because the outside world is looking in and if the world looks and sees these church officers living no different than the world, then there is no testimony. Then verse 9.
I Timothy 3:9a
“Holding the mystery of the faith…”
That’s the word that Paul likes to use with that whole body of revealed truth that was hidden in God until revealed to Paul. The revelation of the mysteries and they were to be held:
I Timothy 3:9b-10
“…in a pure conscience. 10. And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of deacon, being found blameless.”
In other words, without reproach. And then here again is where the wife comes into the picture. She is just as important in God’s sight as the deacon himself, because she is his helper.
So wives of deacons and pastors are to be the same type of a person. Above reproach. And they are to show that love and that faith that comes with the true child of God. Verse 11 describes the role of the woman who is the wife of a deacon.
I Timothy 3:11a
“Even so must their wives be grave,…” That doesn’t mean that they can’t ever smile or to laugh at a good joke, but they are not to be flippant. They are not to be that which does not demand respect. They are:
I Timothy 3:11b
“…not slanderers, (not gossipers) sober, faithful in all things.”
So all these are just simply common sense requirements for Church leadership. Again remember, that this was back in the midst of a pagan idolatrous culture. And those pagans were watching every move they made. No different than today, the world is watching like a hawk at everything Christians do and pounce on the Church every chance they get.
Why did it happen?
Let's continue the conversation on Facebook!
Your opinion matters! Join the conversation on our Facebook page and speak your mind!
The Good News
Salvation is a FREE GIFT from God. You don't have to do anything but believe by faith that God sent His only Son Jesus Christ to die for your sins, was buried, and rose from the dead 3 days later.
THE GOOD NEWS
Salvation is a FREE GIFT from God. SALVATION IS BY FAITH ALONE & FAITH IS BELIEVING WHAT GOD SAYS.
- God declares all mankind sinners and we all fall short of Glory of God. Romans 3:23
- The payment for our sin is death. Romans 6:23
- But God...because he loved you so much sent His own Son, Jesus Christ, to die in your place, for your sins, was buried, and rose from the dead three days later. 1 Cor 15:1-4; 2cor 5:21
All God asks is that you believe by faith alone in 1, 2, & 3. That you're a sinner, separated from God but God sent his Son to die for your sins, was buried & rose again 3 days later.
'that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. '
Do You Believe?